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Manu Samhita: Principle and Implementation-Powerful points to ponder upon!

Manu Samhita: Principle and Implementation

June 4, 2008 - 1:04pm — sita-pati
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Date: 
1 year 32 weeks ago

Being the moderator of this site I get the privilege of promoting my comments to posts. I'd also like to use this as an opportunity to direct your attention to this comments exchange between Krishna-kirti Prabhu [website] and Amara Prabhu [website].

Discussions amongst devotees about how the people in general may be benefited are very auspicious.

Personally I have studied the edition of Manu Samhita pictured here, and also another similar dharma-sastra called the "Yakñavalkya-smrti".

Here's my contribution:

Srila Prabhupada said:

"Manu gave the law known as Manu-samhita, which is full of directions based on varna and asrama concerning how to live as a human being. These are very scientific ways of life, but under the rule of demons like Hiranyakasipu, human society breaks all these systems of law and order and gradually becomes lower and lower. Thus there is no peace in the world. The conclusion is that if we want real peace and order in the human society, we must follow the principles laid down by the Manu-samhita and confirmed by the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krishna."

- Srimad Bhagavatam 7.8.48

In this quote Srila Prabhupada makes a distinction between the time, place, and circumstance specific rules in Manu Samhita and the principles that these implement. Smrti-sastra is generated by empowered brahmanas for the specific situation that it addresses.

"We do not want all these rituals. Chanting Hare Krishna is our only business. According to the Manu-samhita you are all mlecchas and yavanas. You cannot touch the Manu-samhita, what to speak of translating it. So if you try to follow the Manu-samhita then you become a mleccha and yavana and your career is finished"

- Letter to Madhusudhana, May 19, 1977

We might take the particular point which Srila Prabhupada has broken out from Manu Samhita (about women not being CEOs) and highlighted in this commentary, as being specifically indicated by his Divine Grace as normative and desirable, and I'm happy to do that.

At the same time, as Madhava Ghosh pointed out [in this comment], the healthy implementation of the normative role of women cannot be separated from implementation of the normative qualification of men. Varnasrama is about qualification, not just birth. You're not a man just because you were born with male genitals. You have to man up and step up to the role.

When Men are Men, Women are Women

As His Holiness Bhakti Vidya Purna Maharaja put it so succinctly: "When men are men, women are women."

That's a simple yet powerful statement with profound implications in terms of both ideal and strategy for implementation.

A lot of problems come when unqualified men demand that roles be respected when qualification is not present. This is the same dynamic that lead the people to reject the varnas at the time of Buddha. Similarly people have rejected traditional gender roles.

Just as both Buddha and Sankara demonstrated at their relative points in the course of social development, we need intelligent readjustment. We have to keep the goal in sight like the pole star ("normative view" in the language of Krishna-kirti prabhu), and work our way back onto the "royal road" of varnasrama (as Srila Prabhupada describes it Bhagavad-gita—the safer path).

There's not much point dogmatically following the same route the road follows when you've stepped off it. We have to negotiate the actual terrain we are on, and make our way simultaneously forward, and back onto the road.

If we want to see traditional gender roles remanifested in a contemporary context, then we need to understand the essence of them, and also understand how their misuse has lead to their abandonment. Then we can create something that is at the one time contemporary, natural, organic, and functional.

First Deserve, then... you don't even have to Demand

From Satsvarupa Goswami's ISKCON in the 70s:

"If we gain political power, will we follow Manu-samhita?

"First gain power, he said. Then yes, Manu-samhita. Actually everything is in the Gita and Bhagavatam in gist. Manu-samhita is based on varnasrama and that is in the Gita, I created the four orders. First we would divide society into orders by quality and work, not birth. Someone made a brahmana would have to act like a brahmana or else he would be punished."

So first gain power. That means become qualified to lead before demanding that others follow.

As the maxim has it: "He who thinks he leads but has no-one following is merely taking a walk".

"Actually the qualified brahmanas are meant to give direction to the kings for proper administration in terms of the scriptures like the Manu-samhita and Dharma-sastras of Parasara. A typical king is the ideal of the people in general, and if the king is pious, religious, chivalrous and munificent, the citizens generally follow him."

- Srimad Bhagavatam 1.9.27

Qualification is a pre-requisite, and then implementation follows naturally. As Prabhupada points out here, if you have the qualification, you don't need to spend so much time arguing with people about how they should follow you, you just spend your time actually leading them. In the words of Srila Prabhupada, "first deserve, then desire".

So a lot of our time might be better spent focusing on our own qualification than railing at people for not following. It's a poor workman who blames his tools, and a poor leader who blames their "followers."

Andy Stanley puts it: "As soon as you blame your followers you've stopped leading".

This is not to devalue the valuable work that is done by thinkers who contemplate normative views and discuss implementation pathways. However, especially for new devotees their initial focus is better directed to the essential practices of bhakti, such as sadhana, study of sastra, and cultivating Vaisnava qualities and relationships.

I've found that if people respect you as a person they naturally respect what you say. When you give them relevant advice on their personal situation they are more likely to follow it. Change begins with us and then goes one person at a time. A brahmana is one who thinks globally (in fact universally, and beyond), and acts locally. He becomes an empowered agent of positive change.


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[granthraj] Preaching for Purification


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Dr Satish Gosain (Sri Krishna Hari Das) <sri.krishna.hari@gmail.com>

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Bhaskar Jayapal <granthraj@yahoo.com>

 

 Hare Krishna Prabhujis and Mathajis,

 

Please accept our humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada and Srila Gurudeva.

 

Recently HG Vaijayanthi mala Mathaji had shared with us very powerful mails on Gurudev's class on "Fiery devotional service." Our heartfelt thanks to mathaji for sharing the nectar.

 

There were few punching statements which Maharaj had insisted in that class  which we need to practice meticulously.

 

 As Gurudev has insisted in that class

 

a) To remove the seed of sin from our hearts - we need to tightly hold on to Srimad Bhagavatam and
b) The most important qualification for that is to give up the two "C's" - Criticism and Cheating.

 

The taste for Bhagavatam will not come unless we give up the habit of criticising others.  Gurudev has told us that in order to increase the fire of devotional service - we need to be in contact with Srila Prabhupada. Do not open your mouth until and unless you have nice fire (of bhakti) in your existence. Maharaj is also telling us that not only should we avoid using tongues for criticising - but should start using it nicely for preaching Krishna's names and glories. Being close to Krishna, Gurudev is omniscient and know that in the name of being guilty for our sins, we might become depressed and so he has also mentioned - "Before we try to purify others, it goes without saying the necessity of our own purification. Apani acari prabhu jivera shikaaya. If you preach you will slowly improve. In the beginning you are not pure. But because we are telling others, we also start practicing. So please preach."

 

So preaching is primarily for purification of our own selves. Recently when we met Gurudev in Mumbai, he was appreciating the devotees from Chennai for the wonderful Harinam service they were doing weekly and said - "Harinam and preaching are the outward manifestation of internal devotional service we do for the Lord." - Even after hearing how much Gurudev is pleased by this, we did not have full faith in the power of the holy name and devotional service. But still we were doubtful that how is it possible to do Harinam in cities like Bangalore as people are very posh, sophisticated etc. Our godsister HG Sharada mathaji called us last week and said that since it was maargashirsha month - a month very dear to Lord Krishna, we should start doing Harinam. It was as if she was repeating the instruction of our Guru Maharaj to do harinam. Eventhough we were neglecting this instruction Krishna has been mercifully reminding us again through so many ways. Both HG Sharada mathaji and HG Sree Purushottam Prabhuji very enthusiastically organised and invited all the devotees for Harinam program on Jan 7th.

 

When we started the kirtan and distribution of prasadam on the way, we realised how much pious and devoted are the people around. Those great souls whom we met on the way - received the prasad with so much respect - Some people travelling by car or bike - stopped by, got down and removed their footwear, bowed their heads to the prasadam and then honoured it. In that process they were creating traffic jam but they didn't care about it. As it is in India people do not have any traffic sense and are careless about driving, but in this case it was their genuine respect for prasadam that made them become oblivious to the surroundings. At that moment we realised that simply wearing Vaishnava dress, tilak and honouring prasadam daily - in a mechanical manner is not enough. Unless the internal devotional service is not pure and unless we give up critical attitude towards others - there is no way we can approach or please Guru and Krishna.

 

We then went to a big mall in Bangalore, we just thought why not give it a try to go inside and continue with our harinam until they ask us to leave. As we went in unexpected, the huge Saturday evening crowd was first perplexed, then shocked, then watched us with amusement. Then automatically some of them started clapping their hands to the tune of the Harinam. After about 10 mins of kirtan, the security guard came over to one of the devotees and said something. We thought he was asking us to leave the place and started moving. Later when I checked with the devotee about what the security guard spoke to him, he said that the security guard told him, "I am also a Hanuman bhakta". So prabhuji encouraged him to chant the mahamantra since it actually contains the name of the Lord of Hanuman. Finally we completed about 3 kms of nagar sankirtan and returned back to the Balaji temple where we began, and then completed the Harinam. All the devotees and people in the mall were very happy to hear the kirtan and watch the dancing of our devotees.

 

One of the important things we should realize from Srila Prabhupada's mission is that he did all that was supposed to be part of our culture but had vanished over time as people started to adopt western culture. In all the temples, along with the worship of the deities, Bhagavat-gita and Bhagavatam study/class must be going on. Practically this principle is absent in all the temples. And Srila Prabhupada introduced this process very strictly in all the ISKCON temples. Similarly, Harinam and nagar sankirtan has always been part and parcel of the Vedic culture. In due course of time, with the introduction of western culture, people started shying away from chanting in the streets and public, thinking they will be made fun of. But Srila Prabhupada, began this movement practically with Harinam in Tompkins Square Park. Harinam is pleasing to everyone, it not only destroys the greatest of sins (amhasaam mahataam api) of the entire universe but also brings auspiciousness all around (jagan mangalam).

 

While explaining the glories of sankirtan to Parikshit Maharaj, Sukadev Goswami says in Srimad Bhagavatam verse 6.3.31

 

tasmaad sankirtanam vishnor / jagan mangalam amhasaam
mahataam api kauravya / vidy aikaantikam nishkrtam

 

Sukadeva Gosvami continued: My dear King, the chanting of the holy name of the Lord is able to uproot even the reactions of the greatest sins. Therefore the chanting of the sankirtana movement is the most auspicious activity in the entire universe. Please try to understand this so that others will take it seriously.

 

We do not need to be scholars, thinkers, intelligent etc to perform this Harinam service. This is the simplest form of purification of the self as well as the whole world. Let us follow this simple process of purification to the best of our ability and inch closer towards Krishna and Gurudev.

 

Thank you very much,
Yours in service of Srila Prabhupada and Srila Gurudeva,
Kalacakra Krsna das and Sudarshana devi dasi.


Yours Servant

Sri Krishna Hari Das
(Dr Satish Gosain MBBS DNB i Med)

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VEDIC THOUGHT-Sadhu Sanga

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: deepak.lok <deepak.lok@gmail.com>


VEDIC THOUGHT

"An intelligent person should reject all bad association and instead
take up the association of saintly devotees, whose words cut off the
excessive attachment of one's mind."

(Lord Sri Krsna - Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.26.26)

--


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VEDIC THOUGHT-The Slightest Favor

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: deepak.lok <deepak.lok@gmail.com>


VEDIC THOUGHT

"My Lord, if one is favored by even a slight trace of the mercy of
your lotus feet, he can understand the greatness of your personality."

(Lord Brahma's prayers to Lord Krishna - Srimad Bhagavatam 10.14.29)



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VEDIC THOUGHT-A Great Soul

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: deepak.lok <deepak.lok@gmail.com>


VEDIC THOUGHT

"After many births and deaths, he who is actually in knowledge
surrenders unto me, knowing me to be the cause of all causes and all
that is. Such a great soul is very rare."

(Lord Sri Krsna - Bhagavad-gita 7.19)




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Srila Prabhupada speaks on: "What Is Real Leadership"

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Pragosh das <servant@prabhupadavani.org>




"What Is Real Leadership"

January 7, 1974

listen

 

Take a test


Prabhupada: Yes. [Break] They have achieved their advancement of knowledge by seeing a crack in the moon. You know that? Yes. They are now researching, "What is this crack?" For seeing the crack, they spend so much money.

Bali Mardana: They are so foolish.

Prabhupada: Just see.

Bali Mardana: When I was in Hawaii I gave a lecture at one Catholic college, and the priest in charge, he was asking me if in our philosophy we believe that animals have a soul. He's so foolish...

Prabhupada: Eh?

Bali Mardana: The Christians are so foolish, even though they have big learned positions, they do not understand that the animal also has a soul.

Prabhupada: You told? In that meeting?

Bali Mardana: Yeah.

Prabhupada: What did they say?

Bali Mardana: They could not deny. They could not say anything.

Prabhupada: Yes, what is the difference that you say the animals...? How do you say? What is the symptoms of possessing soul? The symptoms of possessing soul is described in the Bhagavad-gita: yena sarvam idam tatam. The consciousness. The animals have no consciousness? How foolish they are!

Bali Mardana: Just to rationalize their sins.

Prabhupada: Yes. No. Rational or not rational...

Bali Mardana: No, to rationalize their meat-eating, they say...

Prabhupada: Yes, to support, yes, their sinful activities.

Bali Mardana: Yes.

Prabhupada: How you can say there is no soul in the animals? What is the reason? What is their reason?

Satsvarupa: At one interview a person said to you, "They do not understand metaphysics, and the human being understands metaphysics."

Prabhupada: Metaphysics. A child also does not understand. So therefore he has no soul? Cut him? They are doing that. They are doing that, so rascal. So do everyone understand metaphysics.

Karandhara: No.

Satsvarupa: They should not be killed if they don't understand.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Satsvarupa: They should not be killed just if they don't understand.

Prabhupada: Yes. Is that any reason?

Devotee: Actually, they have no philosophical basis for that belief that the animal has no soul. It's just speculation. Yes.

Prabhupada: No philosophy. Simply rascaldom. Simply rascaldom. And that is being preached by the priestly class. Priestly class. Just see the society! What third-class society! (pause) [break] ...the soul enters after the birth of the child. Eh? Is it not? Therefore killing or abortion is not bad.

Devotee: Oh, they say that abortion isn't bad because the child is not fully formed and therefore is not really a life. It's not really alive.

Prabhupada: Just see. Therefore one man who is sleeping, he has no soul.

Bali Mardana: No one... They do not believe that generally.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Bali Mardana: They admit that they are killing.

Prabhupada: They admit?

Bali Mardana: That they are killing the child. But they do not care. 'Cause they don't want to take the trouble to raise it.

Gurukrpa: Just like the rabbit.

Prabhupada: Rabbit philosophy. So therefore, considering from all points of view, our Krsna consciousness movement is the best in the world. There is no doubt. You must be convinced about it. Otherwise, how you can preach?

Bali Mardana: Now is a very ripe time to push forward our philosophy.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Bali Mardana: Now it is a very ripe time to push forward our philosophy.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Bali Mardana: I was thinking of taking a full..., large advertisements in New York Times, present our philosophy so that people can read. Everyone will see it.

Prabhupada: No... Now, you... Why don't you publish that...? I have suggested that poster.

Karandhara: That poster?

Bali Mardana: We have a poster?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Karandhara: It's being worked on.

Bali Mardana: I have not seen it.

Prabhupada: Take contribution from public...

Bali Mardana: Oh yeah, yeah.

Prabhupada: ...for one day's advertisement. And advertise this poster in every paper. You see...

Bali Mardana: I want to do that.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Bali Mardana: Also I was thinking to have a large scale propaganda in all the college newspapers.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Bali Mardana: Specifically. To attract...

Prabhupada: The same, one advertisement. What is the...?

Karandhara: "Real leaders of human society."

Prabhupada: Yes. That... You have seen that design I have given?

Karandhara: No, I haven't seen it.

Prabhupada: Oh, it is not yet done?

Karandhara: No, it's being worked on.

Prabhupada: Hm. You can give him the rough idea. That will be very nice propaganda, to select real leaders of the society. The... We are misled by rascal leaders. That is the difficulty, all rascals. If the society is led by real, learned scholars, then it will be nice. Qualified leaders. That is wanted. Leader means better qualified man to lead others. That is leader. Leader does not mean he is himself a fool and leading other fools. [break]

Bali Mardana: ...the poster could have a coupon for Bhagavad-gita to find the real solution...

Prabhupada: No, no.

Bali Mardana: So they can purchase?

Prabhupada: Bhagavad-gita there are so many. They'll purchase another rascal's Bhagavad-gita. Simply you make propaganda that what is real leadership. Then they will inquire and we shall reply. [break] ...so many things. So we may not create any disruption amongst our solidarity. Then things will not make progress. In a big machine, even one screw is slack, the machine stops. You know that? So we should not commit such mistake. "Don't care. It is a small screw." No. Even that small screw can stop the whole machine. [break] ...that we are on the platform of deathlessness. Then we can be careful about falling down. And this is a fact.

Bali Mardana: And we will not want to fall down.

Prabhupada: Yes. That, that is seriousness. Suppose you are going on a plane to Vaikuntha. So your business should be that you may not fall down. The plane may not stop. It is like that. [break] ...Bhagavata, simply this point is being stressed, that "This is the platform of deathlessness."

Bali Mardana: Oh.

Prabhupada: In Bhagavad-gita. [break] Where is that boy? No, not... Oh, you. So you are now living in Mexico?

Devotee: Yes, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Oh, that's nice. He's our old student.

Bali Mardana: Yeah, from New York.

Prabhupada: From New York, yes. [Break] ...fall. Simply by following the regulations and chanting. That's all. (end)

 
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Walk -- January 7, 1974, Los Angeles

© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.

For higher quality audio, you may purchase the MP3s/CDs from www.Krishna.com



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VEDIC THOUGHT-Grahmiya Katha

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: deepak.lok <deepak.lok@gmail.com>


VEDIC THOUGHT

"It is very much regrettable that unfortunate people do not discuss
the description of the Vaikuntha [spiritual] planets but engage in
topics that are unworthy to hear and bewilder one's intelligence.
Those who give up the topics of Vaikuntha and take to talk of the
material world are thrown into the darkest region of ignorance."

(Lord Brahma - Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.15.23)

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Jayadvaita Swami, Questions and Answers on Dhruva Maharaja's Pastimes

Thursday, November 23, 2006

Jayadvaita Swami, Questions and Answers on Dhruva Maharaja's Pastimes

Q: Although the association of devotees is glorified we see in Dhruva's case, he had such brief association with Narada, while most of the time he performed austerities alone.
A: A little association of a devotee is all that is needed for one who takes the instruction seriously. Prabhupada did not have so much physical association with his guru, but he took his instruction to heart.
Once during the Communist times Srila Prabhupada told a devotee to back to his country of Hungary and preach. The devotee was worried that he may not be able leave Hungary again to associate with the devotees. Srila Prabhupada told him not to worry for it did not matter if he never left Hungary again.

Modern means to do what feels good to you (or does not feel artificial). Vedic means to do what is your duty. If people always did what they felt like doing, the world would be in more of a mess than it already is.

Q: Can you explain why the following statement by Narada is true. "Every man should act like this: when he meets a person more qualified than himself, he should be very pleased; when he meets someone less qualified than himself, he should be compassionate toward him; and when he meets someone equal to himself, he should make friendship with him. In this way one is never affected by the threefold miseries of this material world."
A: Well, just think about it. If you are respectful with your superiors, friendly with your equals, and compassionate to juniors, how would you feel? Pretty good, wouldn't you? Uncongenial dealings between people tend to cause a lot of distress.
Srimati Mataji: Could it be that once one gets to such a level of consciousness when he can act properly with others, naturally he will be detached from the distresses of the world?
Krishna-kripa Das: The discussion reminds me in Bhagavad-gita 6.8-9, Krishna says an advanced soul sees arrangements of matter equally, but a more advanced soul can deal with people equally.

While talking about dealing with difficulties, Jayadvaita Swami tells how he was talking with one fellow who had been in the Vietnam War. When the man was recounting his experiences it was clear that all the troubles he went through were the most memorable things. Jayadvaita Swami recalls the time the devotees produced the 17 volumes of Caitanya-caritamrita in two months. It was very intense but a memorable ecstatic experience.

Q: Although Dhruva bathed in the Yamuna and lived in Mahavana, the Lord appeared to Him as Narayana rather than Krishna. Why?
A: Maharaja and the students offered many speculations, but he concluded that we will find out when we attain the spiritual world or we meet someone a lot more qualified than him. Some of the suggestions were:
• That Narada had described the Narayana form of God to Dhruva, and thus it was what he was meditating on.
• Narayana was Narada's own worshipable deity as he worshiped the Lord in opulence.
• Narada knew Dhruva's svarupa was with Narayana, and so he instructed Dhruva thus.

Q: How does sense gratification destroy mercy?
A: Arunzeb put his father in jail to take his kingdom. The U.S.A. killed 600,000 people in Iraq in the recent war to protect their oil interests. The cigarettes manufacturers know what cigarettes do to people's health yet they are always making plans to get innocent young people addicted to them so they can make money.

Q: Austerity is sometimes said to make one's heart harder, yet Dhruva Maharaja performed so many austerities. How do we know what austerities to perform so that our heart will not become hard?
A: That is why the spiritual master is required, to select the austerities. Not that we say no to all austerities claiming that we want to keep our heart soft for Krishna and austerity might make it hard.

Q: I have heard that things get really hard after second initiation why is that?
A: I have not heard that anywhere. Where does it say that Krishna makes life difficult for people after second initiation?


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H.H. Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami on Married Life

H.H. Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami on Married Life

Posted On: Wed, 2008-09-10 04:33 by sitapati Share

H.H. Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami gave this very insightful and thought-provoking class on the grhasta ashram (married life) when he visited Brisbane a few months ago.

It is full of examples and analogies that I had never heard before, which is unusual for a class in an ISKCON temple, which usually consists of refreshing and reinforcing things that are already in my head.

I like the feeling of neural rewiring, so I enjoyed it. Useful information too.


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How can I know if God Exists?

View Online
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJbJayhYxG4

download
http://www.kissyoutube.com/watch?v=xJbJayhYxG4

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Srila Prabhupada speaks on: "Unlimitedly Merciful Lord"


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Pragosh das <servant@prabhupadavani.org>


"Unlimitedly Merciful Lord"

Melbourne, June 29, 1974

listen 

Take a test


Prabhupada: ...in the beautiful tomb. Then how do you go? Either hell or heaven, that doesn't matter. So how do you go there?

Madhudvisa: They say that the material body and the soul join back together again at the end.

Prabhupada: That is dehantara-prapti, another body.

Madhudvisa: No, they say same body.

Prabhupada: Same body means same material body. The form may be different. The form is actually different, because this form is lying in your tomb. It is not going. Where that... If it has gone, then why the body is here? That is dehantara, another body. How you can say the same body? The same body is lying here. After death, if the same body is going, then why the same body is not going? Why it is lying here? They must be reasonable, not dogmatic. How it is same body?

Satsvarupa: I don't understand their philosophy.

Prabhupada: Pure nonsense. Same body, how can you? The body is here.

Madhudvisa: The body is rotting in the tomb, and then they say that the body at the end of the creation is reconstructed and reunited with the soul.

Prabhupada: That's all right, but not this body. Reconstruct.

Madhudvisa: That they say, this body.

Prabhupada: That is their foolishness. This body, you can say, this is material body; that is also material body. But not this body. Just like you change your cloth. The other cloth also made of cotton, and this is also made of cotton. In the same way, you can say, "the same body," cotton body or dress. But you cannot say that this cloth or this dhoti is going with you. How they can say? This body is lying here. This body means this material body.

Madhudvisa: They will say, "Some things you cannot understand. You must simply accept on faith."

Prabhupada: "You cannot understand" -- that is also good. Suppose a child cannot understand. But there must be some explanation. Otherwise, how in advanced stages one can accept. They will say, "dogmatic." This body means this material body, and this material body has got so many shapes, 8,400,000. So hell means... This is also hellish. A tree is standing for five thousand years or five hundred years. Is it not hellish? If I ask you, "Stand here for five days," you will die. (laughing) If there is such order from the government, "You stand here for so many days..."

Satsvarupa: Naked. Naked too.

Prabhupada: Naked. This is hellish. (dog barking) Now this, another hellish life. His only business is to bark. The master may like to keep a dog, but if he is said that "You also become a dog," he will not agree. Will he agree?

Madhudvisa: But whether he agrees or not, he will become one, if he is too much attached. [break] ...the chief engineer of building the chariots, and all of these people are his assistants.

Prabhupada: Jagannatha will be very much pleased upon you. Yes. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trayate mahato bhayat. Little service to God is taken as great service. Krsna is so kind. So we should try always to give the best service, best energy, and you become liberated. Actually we cannot give any service to Krsna. He is unlimited. What is the value of our service? But He takes it seriously: "Oh, he is trying to give me some service." Otherwise what service He needs from us? Suppose He has created these big universes, what service we can give? By His will, He can create millions of universes. What service we can give? We... No. These are the chances of service, this Ratha-yatra. God is so great, so big, how we can pack up in the ratha. But this is a chance, that you get Him sit on the ratha and prepare it, manufacture it. Because your energy is engaged for His service, that is accepted. So this example... Just like a small child eating lozenges, and out of that, if he offers father, "Father, take it," and father takes it very serious..., "Ah, very nice." And what is that lozenges to the father? It is nothing. But because the child offers to the father in love, father takes it very seriously: "Oh, you are so nice. Yes, yes, give me." That is stated in Bhagavad-gita. Patram puspam phalam toyam yo me bhaktya prayacchati: [Bg. 9.26] "A leaf, a fruit, a little water." What is the value of these? But yo me bhaktya prayacchati: "Because he is giving Me in faith and devotion, I accept it." And what is this one piece of leaf and a fruit for God? It is nothing. He is being served by many thousands of goddess of fortune. Laksmi-sahasra-sata-sambrahma-sevyamanam. Then what is the value of this leaf and flower and fruit? But still, He says, tad aham asnami: "Yes, I eat them." And once God eats from your hand, then your life is successful.

Madhudvisa: Sometimes a question is arisen that devotees are working hard to serve Krsna, but sometimes they don't feel that they are working in love and devotion. They are doing the work, but sometimes...

Prabhupada: Yes, in the beginning there is no love. Let him work on the direction of God's representative. [break] Therefore it has been warned, arcye visnau sila-dhir gurusu nara-matir vaisnave jati-buddhih. The Deity of Visnu, if one thinks, "This is made of stone; this is made of wood; this is made of metal," and spiritual master as ordinary human being, these are hellish considerations. Arcye visnau sila-dhir gurusu nara-matih. Gurusu means the spiritual master. Nara-matih, a ordinary human being. And vaisnave jati-buddhih. And Vaisnava, a devotee -- "Oh, he is brahmana Vaisnava. He is European Vaisnava. He is this Vaisnava, that..." No. These are forbidden. Vaisnava is Vaisnava. Spiritual master... They are all transcendental. In... of course, in this country you are introducing new, but in India... Just like we had been at Tirupati, Tirumala. Many thousands of people were coming, and their daily collection is not less than 100,000 rupees. And do you think these people are coming to offer these 100,000 rupees daily to a stone? And the acaryas established this temple for bluffing these people? Does it mean, their collecting? They do not know the science, rascals. And therefore simply... Sinful life cannot help. Vina pasughnat [SB 10.1.4]. That is stated in the Srimad-Bhagavatam, that "One who is killer of animal, he cannot understand the spiritual science." Vina pasughnat [SB 10.1.4]. This is the statement. Pasughna means the animal killer. Therefore the first prohibition is stop this animal killing. Otherwise, this dull brain will not be able to understand. They are not fit for understanding. Mudha, mudha. Na mam duskrtino mudhah [Bg. 7.15]. Duskrtina means always engaged in sinful activities. They have got brain but their brain is being utilized only for sinful activities, they are called duskrtina. Krti, krti means good brain, and duskrti means brain is being utilized for sinful act. Therefore they are mudha. In spite of good brain, they are rascals, because brain is being utilized for sinful activities, how to set up up-to-date machinery for killing animals. Brain is being used for this purpose. Any animal can be killed with ordinary knife, but they're manufacturing latest machinery. Their brain, rascal brain is being used for that purpose. And what they will understand? They are preparing their road for going to hell. What they will understand about spiritual matters? Nature will not excuse. That is not possible. [break] That is sufficient for your being killed. Yes, sir. Wherefrom these laws come unless there is God's laws? Everyone will be killed. They are thinking that "We are not going to slaughterhouse to kill. They kill; we purchase." The Buddhist says like that. Everyone says like that. Therefore, according to Vedic scripture, those animal-eaters, they should kill them personally so that they can see how much suffering is there, so he will stop. But now the things are being done in the slaughterhouse. They do not see. They purchase very nicely packed. They do not know. And they are becoming implicated. Therefore, according to Vedic injunction, if you want to eat meat, you kill yourself in your front, in the front of goddess Kali. So that the animal will get next life as human being. He is promoted immediately. He hasn't got to go to the evolutionary process. He gets immediately. And it is given right that "After you get human form of (life), you can kill this person." You see? This is the process of bali-dana, mantra and everything. [Break] ...regulation that... that is not cow. An insignificant animal, goat... (end)

 
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Walk -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne

© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.

For higher quality audio, you may purchase the MP3s/CDs from www.Krishna.com


I have personally seen this in train,  a small kid is eating some snacks and offering some to her father. The father refuses but the kid is persistent about giving it to the father and atlast the father accepted.

Your Servant
dinesh


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How can I know if God Exists?

View Online
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJbJayhYxG4

download
http://www.kissyoutube.com/watch?v=xJbJayhYxG4


Source:http://www.youtube.com/user/radhanathswamionline#p/u/1/xJbJayhYxG4

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The Dangers of Criticizing Others

The Dangers of Criticizing Others

Monday, November 13, 2006

Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami, Srimad-Bhagavatam Canto 1, Chapter 6

Krishna cannot be attained by following the rules and regulations.

Vaishnava association is the foundation of our spiritual life. We have to learn how to appreciate the Vaishnavas. If you feel it is your business to find fault with devotees when it is not (when you are not playing the role of their spiritual superior, guru, teacher, parents, etc.) then you are in a dangerous position. The ability to find fault should be applied to ourselves, without pride, to make advancement by giving up our bad qualities.

The jiva (individual soul) is always small and dependent, and thus we must always follow the devotees, even in the spiritual world. If we analyze how we joined the Hare Krishna movement we will see it was due to association with some devotee. We advance by appreciating the good qualities of the devotees. We avoid falling down by avoiding association of people with bad qualities.

If we criticize someone, according to Mahabharata, we take on their bad qualities. If someone criticizes us and we do not get angry, that person takes your bad qualities.

Lord Caitanya said he would distribute the accumulated sinful reactions of the most evil Jagai and Madhai to those people who criticize the Lord's devotees.

In India many people know the Vedic culture but not so much the philosophy. In the Hare Krishna movement, we tend to assimilate the philosophy, but we have not really embraced the culture.

In preparing Mahabharata Vyasadeva watered down the philosophy so much to make it accessible to the people in general that it had lost the potency to be effective. [When Maharaja said that it made me wonder if we sometimes do that in our own preaching strategies. At least we should be careful not to.]

If one has strong faith in eternal damnation, it means he has little faith in the power of devotional service to God.

Krishna says in Bhagavad-gita:
• Do your duty
• In knowledge
• Without attachment
• Thinking of Krishna
• For the pleasure of Krishna

We tend to have problems understanding the first three.

Notes on Srimad-Bhagavatam Canto 4, Chapter 4 (entitled "Sati Quits Her Body") discussion: In a discussion about using anger in God's service, Sarvabhauma Prabhu reminded us of this pastime:
Someone asked Srila Prabhupada, "Is God love?"
Prabhupada replied, "Yes, but God is also hate."
God hates to see innocent devotees tortured by the demoniac.

"One should be extremely careful about associating with persons who are not respectful to the higher authorities" (SB 4.4.26). This applies to persons within and outside the Hare Krishna movement.

We can learn from the chapter on Sati's quitting her body.
• We should not hear blamphemy of great souls.
• We should try to rectify blamphemers.
• Having all material facility without pure devotional service doesn't satisfy our soul.


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Hopes & Horrors of Household Life-HH.Jayadvaita Swami


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Brahmacarya <16rounds@gmail.com>



Brahmacarya.info


Hopes & Horrors of Household Life

Posted: 13 Jan 2010 12:23 PM PST

family

This is a seminar by His Holiness Jayadvaita Swami on the topic of Hopes & Horrors of Household Life.

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Part 1:
Download audio file (JAS_Sem_Hopes-Horrors-Household-Life_part1_2001_Radhadhes_be.mp3)
[download]

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Part 2:
Download audio file (JAS_Sem_Hopes-Horrors-Household-Life_part2_2001_Radhadhes_be.mp3)
[download]

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Part 3:
Download audio file (JAS_Sem_Hopes-Horrors-Household-Life_part3_2001_Radhadhes_be.mp3)
[download]

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Part 4:
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[download]

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Part 5:
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[download]

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Part 6:
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[download]

===========================================

Part 7:
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[download]

Gratest Suffering

Posted: 13 Jan 2010 11:25 AM PST

krishna-uddhava

TRANSLATION

Of all kinds of suffering and bondage arising from various attachments, none
is greater than the suffering and bondage arising from attachment to women
and intimate contact with those attached to women.

PURPORT

One should make a great endeavor to give up intimate contact with women and
those fond of women. A learned gentleman will automatically be on guard if
placed in intimate contact with lusty women. In the company of lusty men,,
however, the same man may engage in all kinds of social dealings and thus be
contaminated by their polluted mentality. Association with lusty men is
often more dangerous than association with women and should be avoided by
all means. There are innumerable verses in the Bha-gavatam describing the
intoxication of material lust. Suffice it to say that a lusty man becomes
exactly like a dancing dog and, by the influence of Cupid, loses all
gravity, intelligence and direction in life. The Lord warns here that one
who surrenders to the illusory form of a woman suffers unbearably in this
life and the next.

[Ref. - SB 11.14.30]

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Bhakti Vidyapurna Swami speak on family attachment,08 01 2010 Mayapur Gurukula


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: ISKCON Desire Tree Devotee Network <mail@iskcondesiretree.net>


Connecting Devotees Worldwide - In Service Of Srila Prabhupada

A message to all devotees of ISKCON Desire Tree Devotee Network


Question: What if we take care of our family members who are devotees? This is also spiritual activity.

BVPS: Yes, it could be, but not necessarily. Let's say you are coming home and your kid is chanting Hare Krsna. So when you start telling him about your day, how did it go, what happened, what kind of problems you had, challenges, etc, so your kid just go on chanting? Because he is a devotee and that what the devotees do, they chant. So you are saying that if the kid reciprocates in this way, you will be happy? Because that's way you got married; you just like to be around devotees who chant Hare Krsna. But if it is like this, way taking so much trouble to get married, to raise the child, you just go in the temple and there are plenty of devotees who sit and chant. But is this enough for you? You get the point?

You say I take care of them because they are devotees, but if it is so then there are so many devotees around you don't take care. There are so many kids around, but you don't care about them. You feed your own child; you take care of your own child. Not the child of the neighbor although they are also devotee's children. Why? Because you are attached to the body of your kid, because his body is connected with your body. It is based on material attachment. You think in terms of I and mine. If you are on spiritual platform then everybody is a soul and everybody is a devotee. But you don't see in this way and therefore you are attached to your own family members.

If it is connected to Krsna, this attachment is not a problem, therefore Krsna made the grihasta asram. But to connect it with Krsna first we have to admit that it is there. We have to admit that this is why I got married on a first place, because I am materially attached. And once this is recognized then it is a question of connecting this attachment to Krsna. In this way it becomes purified and there is no problem. The problem comes when the devotees don't want to admit this attachment; they think I am just practical, down to earth, etc. But in this case they cannot purify it, it just stays with them.

It is said that with the same amount of endeavor that is needed to keep a family together one could run an empire. But if it is so, then why taking the trouble of family life, why put so much energy to work for the spiritual elevation of only 2-3 people, with the same amount of energy, if you go out and preach, you could benefit so many people. Not just 2-3 but many, many more. So if the main focus in your life is to help people be Krsna conscious, then the grihasta asram might not be the best situation because it seriously limits your preaching field to just few persons.
So one is not supposed to base his life on attachment only. Attachment is there, it is understood, but there are higher principles. Attachment means feeling; I feel like doing or not doing something. I feel like not sending my kids to Gurukula because I feel attached and don't want to be separated from them. But you are going to be separated from your children anyway, there is no question about it. It is going to happen. The only choice you have is – you will be separated from them and this separation will give you a religious result, or you are going to be separated from them and this will give you irreligious result. You will either send them to Gurukula and not see them for 10-15-20 years, but when they come back they will be trained nicely and will stay with you for the rest of your life and will take care of you, or you will not send them, you will keep them at home and they will leave you anyway and will not return. So this is the choice you have. But many devotees base their life on attachment and they don't do this because they don't feel like doing it. This is not an elevated platform.

Yes, it is true that Manu mentions that the grihasta asram is the most important asram, but it is because it supports the other asrams. The brahmacaris, vanaprasthas, sanyasis, they are beggars, they don't have money and they should be supported. But if the grihastas are opposed to the sanyasis and the brahmacaries, don't support them, then they become the worst asram, in fact they cannot be considered an asram anymore, they become grihamedi. Grihamedhi means the house is in the center of ones life. Griha means house, medhi – center. Grihast means Krsna is in the center. So it is a question of consciousness.

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Couping up with Mental Offences!

Couping up with Mental Offences!

Posted by
Vrajarani Devi Dasi on December 12, 2009 at 11:09am


I would like to share some of the very important points to be

remembered & practiced daily in our day to day life to coup up with
the Mental Offences. These points are abstracted from a SB class by HG
Gaur Gopal Prabhu. Please note that, these are not word to word
transcription of the lecture.



Prabhuji started with how important it is to please vaisnavas. We can
not see Krishna directly whether He is pleased or not with our
endeavor, but we can see devotees being pleased or not. e.g. If we
want to water the root of the tree we don't pull out the root & put
water on it, but we put water thru the soil. So, devotees are like the
soil thru which Krishna receives services……



Among all other offenses Vaisnava Aparadh is the most dangerous. In
the Purport Srila Prabhupada writes that that we can tolerate the
scorching heat of the sun on our head but it is difficult to tolerate
the same on our feet. Since devotees are always at the Lotus Feet of
the Lord, so, any offence to the devotees will not be tolerated by
Krishna.



Among the vaisnava aparadh, mental offence to a vaisnava is the most
dangerous as these are unidentified; no one is there to tell us or
warn us that we are committing offenses. Other seen offences can be
told & corrected by our devotee friends, but this is not…. So we
should be very carefull.



Types of Mental Offence:



1) Judging someone's character or motivation based on his
particular type of behavior or mistake: e.g. some time we may see that
after a long time some particular devotee calls us over telephone and
asking our wellbeing. That time we may think in our mind that there
might be some motives in his calling after such a long time, that he
wants some particular favour from me like that. Another example, some
time we see some particular devotee is doing something or behaving in
some unnatural manner, then we may think that his character is like
that only…..These are great offences.





2) Revange Fantacies: it mostly comes into our mind during japa
time. Some time it happens that we think about some particular devotee
& we think of taking some revenge. In our mind we may think that 'when
he tells this way, I will reply this way' or even we may think of some
physical revenge….. This is also a type of mental offence.





3) Imagined or Perceived Wrong: e.g. some time we say 'Haribol' to
some devotee & he doesn't reciprocate, then we may think that this
devotee doesn't like me or he neglects me like that…. All we have done
is that we just imagined wrong. May be he is thinking of something
very important & not noticed you……



Effect of Mental Offence:



a) It sucks our taste in Krishna Consciousness & Holy Name

b) It leads to verbal or physical offence

c) It leads to find fault even in Guru & Krishna

d) Eventually all our anarthas & conditionings come up, especially
LUST. e.g. Saburi Muni's cause of fall down is offence to Garuda.



Steps to Coup up with Mental Offences:



1) To remind ourselves that ' He is Right' i.e. giving him
benefit of doubt: Although we see some devotee behaving in some
peculiar manner, we should think that what he is doing is right, may
be I don't understand him. In this way giving him the benefit of doubt
we will keep ourselves from committing mental offence to him. Clear
communication is very important in this case to get the actual
situation. So, we should always get the things clarified & not think
something as our own mind tells…..





2) He Know Not: We should think that may be he doesn't know the
particular fact & so behaving like this. So, without thinking wrong
about him, we may communicate the message to him thru some one he
trusts upon. Thereby we can avoid committing mental offence.





3) I Know Not: We know that we don't know each & everything. We are
not Paramatma. So, there is possibility that what I think or perceive
is not always correct. This is another way to avoid mental offence.





4) Hate the sin & not the sinner: Srila Prabhupada always used to
quote this. He who is without fault may see fault in other to correct
him, but we should not find fault in others as we ourselves are
covered with so many faults. (Recently HG Vaiyasaki Prabhu told me
that fault finding is the deptt of Yamaraja & so let him do his duty.
He is perfect in his duty. According to Bhagvat Gita, we should not do
someone else's duty even if we do it perfectly…….). So, we should hate
the sin & avoid doing that. We should not find fault in the sinner;
rather we may try to correct him. Further, correction should be
Positive Correction and Not Forced Correction.





5) Look for Right / Good: We can always bring the best from a
person if we treat nicely. If we keep on seeing the problems, we would
be consumed by the problems. So, we should always try to see good in
others. If we are gunagrahi we can avoid committing vaisnava
aparadh…..





6) Praying for Right: We should pray to the Lord, " My dear
Krishna, if I am right & he is wrong, please change him; and if he is
right & I am wrong then please change me as I don't want to commit
offence" If we pray like that Krishna will surely reciprocate & save
us from committing offences…..





7) Write the Right: We should write the good qualities of the
devotee in a paper. If we so desire, we can even hand it over to him,
it will establish a good relation / understanding among us. Even if we
don't dare to give it to him, still it will be very helpful in our
part to coup up with mental offences.



So, these are the points Prabhuji has mentioned from practical
experiences, which you won't find any book. Prabhuji has described all
these points so elaborately with sighting so many practical examples.
I could only mention, what ever my short memory could remember.



Prabhuji also stressed that it won't work if we just memorise these
points. We should apply it in our daily life, & then we can see the
result.



So, Dear Devotees, Please pray for me that I can also follow these
steps & prevent myself from committing offences towards you & other
vaisnavas.



Thank you very much!
Vrajarani Devi Dasi

source:http://www.radhanathswami.us/forum/topics/couping-up-with-mental

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Website Discovered!

http://www.radhanathswamiweekly.com/

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Why is There Suffering in the World?

to view online:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTePR_8jluw

to download:
http://www.kissyoutube.com/watch?v=UTePR_8jluw

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